S1 E10: Being Queer Online, Online Hate and Having Tough Conversation with Jordan Myrick
In today’s episode I talk to Jordan Myrick, @jordanmyr1ck. Jordan is a writer, comedian, and actor. You can see Jordan in tons of comedy projects and all over TikTok.
Summary
Taylor Ray interviews Jordan Myrick, an NYU Tisch BFA graduate, comedian, and actor, about their journey from drama studies to professional comedy, including work with Upright Citizens Brigade and Story Pirates, and their TikTok presence. They discuss Jordan's experiences being LGBTQ+ online, and content creation alongside their partner. The conversation also covers the challenges and implications of monetizing hobbies, confronting online hate speech, and the specific anxieties faced by millennials and Gen Z. Jordan shares insights on public discourse around racism, social justice, and the impact of parasocial relationships.
Key Moments
Comedy, Queer Identity, Online Hate, Tough Conversations (00:00:07 - 00:45:53)
Taylor Rae interviews Jordan Myrick, an NYU Tisch BFA graduate, comedian, and actor, about their journey from drama studies to professional comedy, including work with Upright Citizens Brigade and Story Pirates, and their TikTok presence. They discuss Jordan's experiences with being LGBTQ+ online, and content creation alongside their partner. The conversation also covers the challenges and implications of monetizing hobbies, confronting online hate speech, and the specific anxieties faced by millennials and Gen Z. Jordan shares insights on public discourse around racism, social justice, and the impact of parasocial relationships.
Transcription
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Hello and welcome back. My name is Taylor Ray and this is another episode of on the outside. Hello, welcome back. This is another episode. And this week I am talking with Jordan, Myrick Jordan and I went to NYU together. We got our B FA S in drama at NYU Tish. We had the time of our lives hanging out. I truly remember Jordan being like the funniest person ever.
And when we were recording this to, I had to keep muting my mic because I was laughing hysterically. So I already told Jordan like you are very funny and I want you to know again that I think Jordan is hilarious and I mean, they should be because they're professional comedians. So it all really makes sense in today's episode. I talked to Jordan, Myrick Jordan is a writer, comedian and actor. You can see Jordan in tons of comedy projects and all over tiktok. Before moving to L A.
They received their B FA and drama at NYU Tisch School of the Arts, traveled all over North America performing with the Upright Citizens Brigade Touring Company and brought kids stories to life on stage with the story pirates. In this episode, we discuss being queer online, being a content creator experiencing online hate and how to have tough conversations that started out by hearing about a time when Jordan felt like they were an outsider.
Jordan Myrick
I feel like I felt like an outsider a lot growing up because I moved around a lot. So I was always the new kid and I also struck out like a thor. I also stuck out like a, oh my God. I feel like an outsider in my own body right now. I also stuck out like a sore thumb because I was chubby and very tall. So I hit maybe like 5657, maybe in like the second or third grade.
So I was an actual giant. I was bigger than a lot of my teachers and that was a thing that people definitely wanted to let me know. And I remember in elementary school, the kids used to call me Shamu because, you know, I was big and beautiful and I thought that I grew up in South Florida and I thought that they were calling me Shamu because I was so good at swimming.
I had like no concept of like bodies or like what I looked like or shame at this point. So I was like, yes, because we all were swimming all the time. We lived in South Florida. I was like, yes, we're all swimming. I'm truly incredible at swimming still to this day I wanted a snorkeling tour recently. And the boat captain was like, wow, you're such a strong, you're such a strong swimmer.
I'm such a good swimmer. So I was like, yeah, that makes sense. They're calling me Shamu. Shamu is icon a good swimmer. So am I and then a teacher pulled me aside and was like, I asked them to stop doing that. And I was kind of like, oh, why is it making the other kids jealous? And she was like, no, doesn't it like, hurt your feelings? And I was like, why would it hurt my feelings?
And she was like, well, they're calling you fat. And I was like, ok, it was a big rec record. It was a big record scratch moment for me where I was like, oh, ok. I need to be a little more aware of what people are saying about me. And I feel like that just kind of continued I think because I was much bigger in every single way than all of the other Children around me.
I became a target for anything. One time when I was in elementary school, a girl asked me if I liked fruits or vegetables better. I said vegetables which still rings true. And she then told everyone, oh, since you like vegetables better, that means you're a lesbian. And then that became a thing which honestly is like, so upsetting because I am a lesbian. So she was Right. She read me like a book, in the first grade.
So that was hard, you know, that's hard to deal with now. But, yeah, I think I just was so, I was so notably visibly an outsider because I was new at all these schools. I was a giant and I'm, I'm loud and I was a little unaware clearly. And I think that kind of started of me being like, oh, I'm maybe a little different than other people around me.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Let's get into our conversation.
Jordan Myrick
So my name is Jordan Myrick. I'm a queer comedian, writer, actor, content creator, whatever will pay me money in Los Angeles. And I am an on camera personality and writer. And you might have also seen me on dropout formerly college humor and are in other random things on the internet.
I never know. I'm like, I just recite my resume, I guess. I'm a regular performer at the Upright Citizens Brigade. Yeah. And I make content predominantly food content and comedy content on social media.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
I wanted to take it back to Jordan's outsider story.
I love so much that you, I mean, honestly, I wish that teacher didn't say anything to you and you just were like shamo compliment. Love that for me. I love that you're still a strong swimmer and I that was a record scratch moment was a great way to describe it. I do hate that for you. You were thriving, you were like, I'm a swimming queen. Like, love it.
Jordan Myrick
Absolutely. I mean, I look back at pictures of myself from that time and I am like sausaged into like limited to Sophie that say like soccer across the back or whatever. I'm just looking like Hodor from Game of Thrones. I'm an absolute giant and I had no clue like my parents were like, live your best life. I was and then, you know, the outside came in and took that all away from me. So I think it's like, not something that I feel like in my everyday life, I'm like, I'm still traumatized by that. But I think it does feel like a distinct moment when I was like, oh, I always felt like I was different in like a fun way and my parents are big and being like, be different be yourself, which is like, so nice and I'm so lucky to have that. But I think that does feel like those moments feel like distinct moments where I was visibly different than everyone else. And I was like, oh, not everyone thinks that is good. Not everyone likes that.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
As with most of our episodes, we brought it back to our childhoods to get us started.
Do you feel like the way your parents, you know, your, your support from your parents?
Jordan Myrick, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Do you feel like that, that aged well with you or do you feel like it ended up like impacting you any kind of way, you know, I, I think it aged well because I think my parents, my parents were like, being different is better than being normal.
Jordan Myrick
But my parents were not like, you're the best. So I think that was a big difference. My parents are big time realists. They're very practical. They're not very emotional or lovey dovey. So I think my parents were like, being normal is boring. Who cares about that?
But my parents were also like, you're fine and my parents both come from big families, but I'm an only child. So I think my parents were very interested in being like, we need to keep you humble because, you know, only Children can go really, really wrong. Yes.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Yes. I know. My parents did tell me I was the best every day. You're the best. You're the best. You're the best, which I loved at the time. But as I got older, I was like, interesting. There can only be one best and looks like other people also are good. Don't know how to process that.
Jordan Myrick
Yeah, I feel like we had a reverse experience because my parents were like, you're actually not the best a lot. Like I really wanted to play the piano and my parents were just like, ok, well, you're not good at it. So you have to practice and if you're not gonna practice, you're gonna continue to not be good at it because like, you're not a piano prodigy like wake up.
So I think when I was younger, I was like, please tell me I'm the best. Please tell me, you know what I mean? Like I was like, please give it to me, like, tell me I'm the best of all the sex workers in this production of Les Mis that I'm doing at community theater. My parents would always be like, no, you're fine. And they'd be like, we love you and like you're talented and my parents are, my parents supported me. My parents let me go to NYU my, you know, when I auditioned for NYU, my parents were like, we cannot afford it. So you cannot go to NYU. But if you want to audition as practice for auditioning, you're more than welcome to do that. So I did that and then I got in and my parents were like, oh, well, we didn't think you'd get in. So I guess now we'll, he, we'll send you to NYU and help you because if they be, you know, if they are saying you can do it, we already kind of felt like you could do it. So we have to like, take a leap on this thing.
Jordan Myrick, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
So they're very, very supportive, but they're not, oh, they're not compliment, as I mentioned earlier in the intro, Jordan and I met when we were both at NYU and I can't believe that that was over 10 years ago.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Now, I do have to say your content comes all the time across my tiktok. I am a, I am constantly, I'm chronically online and it's something I'm working on because it does make my brain melt. Like, it genuinely takes me to a place sometimes. And I'm like, oh, I'm unhappy that I'm still scrolling. Like I must stop. So I am working on that. I'm in the process. I have an episode talking, yeah, I have an episode talking to my mom and she's like, I start my day, my mom's like the best queen of morning routines and she's like, I start my day at 5 a.m. with journaling and like affirmations. And my mom has like 500 journals just spread out across her kitchen table. She like, lights a candle. She like meditates. She just, yeah, just gorgeous morning. And she's like, I know you start the morning on your phone and I'm like, yes, girl, I do.
I do. And it's not who I want to be. Sure. The great times when your content comes across my page, I'm part of a problem.
Jordan Myrick
I know.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
I, I think it's so interesting, like knowing someone in real life because you are. Exactly. I mean, as far as I can tell, I feel like, and I wonder what your thoughts are.
Jordan Myrick
I would agree. I think, depending on what it is. I'm just varying versions of myself. I think I try to stay authentic to myself unless I'm getting paid to be acting, because that costs more money and takes more time and effort. So I'm like, unless you're paying for that you're just gonna get a version of me, that's the reality of the situation. But I think I'm heightened.
You know, sometimes I will get haters that are like, oh, my God, I, I can't. Jordan is so self centered. She never shuts up. I wish they would shot up whatever. And I'm like, yeah, that's my job. I have to go on this thing and talk. If I go to a party, I'm not gonna run to the center of the room of the party and just start talking out loud and giving my opinion on stuff.
Jordan Myrick, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
So I think that's like the one thing that maybe people would be surprised by is that I'm not, I'm not super opinionated in real life to people, especially that don't know me that well, when I first started creating an online platform, especially being that I talk about topics like anti-racism, education, human rights, mass incarceration, social justice.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
It was pretty scary to be vulnerable about those topics and also honestly strong enough to endure the criticism and harassment that I sometimes faced. It also was just really stressful. And for me specifically, those topics really weighed heavy on my heart and I had to find a way to manage that Jordan and I went on to discuss more about social media.
Yeah, I think that's such a great point actually that you're making because I feel like similarly a lot of what I talk about on my social platform. But also just when I'm hired to like lead a training or a panel or speak at an event or something like that, I'm always talking about like racial justice and anti racism, education, mass incarceration reform.
Like these are the things that I'm not only educated on. So they're the things I know like what I'm talking about, like I can't talk about a million other topics, but these are the ones I can and do. But in normal everyday life, I am relatively reluctant to spend tons of my mental and emotional labor, which might be a little bit different than how you're saying you don't 24 7 share your opinion.
But I think there are some similarities like I don't, I don't run up to everyone and like give them a history lesson and like talk to them about all the things I care about and like, really try to be like, so what do you think about this?
Paras social relationships are non reciprocal, socio, emotional connections with media figures such as celebrities or influencers. The concept of a paras social relationship was coined in 1956 by Horton and Wall to describe the way mass media users acted like they were in a typical social relationship with a media figure. A sense of intimacy and closeness develops on one side, but the other party in all likelihood does not know the former exists over the years.
As the media industry has grown, paras social relationships have become more common. The one sided nature of a relationship is more obvious when that relationship exists between a viewer and a character in a TV show but enters a gray area when it is between real people such as with influencers.
Jordan Myrick
When you get paid to do something, it is your job. And I think paras social relationships have blurred those lines of things. And I love sharing my life. I love sharing my opinions. I love what I do. But at the same time, I'm not just out here on a street corner with the sign screaming out my thoughts. Like I get paid to give my thoughts to write my thoughts, to speak my thoughts.
So when I am getting paid, I will do that. And then in my regular life, I just want to hang out. I don't know. I just want to like, relax. You don't want to be doing your job all the time. So you, you know, people will say, oh, do what you love and you'll never work a day in your life. But it's actually like, do what you love and you will work every single day until you die.
Because when your job is your hobby and your hobby is your job and your hobby is your passion and that's your job, you have to be so thoughtful and careful about differentiating between what is work and what is pleasure. What is a relationship, a friendship? When are you working? You know, like all those things can really, really easily mush together.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
There are honestly countless articles that have been written over the last few years about monetizing hobbies and turning passions into side hustles. Now, more than ever, individuals use social media to amplify their hobbies, turning them into revenue streams and potentially into businesses. Sometimes this leads to fulfillment other times to regret.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
But often somewhere in the middle, the roughest part of being a hostess was having to wear five inch heels that the roughest part like the job could have done it all the time in sneakers.
Jordan Myrick
But I remember when you worked there and I was looking for a job and you were like, would you want to work here? This is how you have to dress. And I was like, no, I'm gonna go get a job at a Mexican restaurant and went and worked as a hostess at a Mexican restaurant and like wore sneakers because I was like, I don't have in me what Taylor has.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
No, it was so rough. I had to get a letter from my podiatrist because he was like, your bunions are out of control. Like you, audiences are humongous and you're not, you're not. Ok. So when I was doing that, I knew, OK, this is, you know, I'm at work. I'm not at work. But when one, you work from home and you work from home and it's like your passion, like it's so there's so many times that the lines get blurred.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
So I think that's a great point and that I really resonate with that violence attributed to online hate speech has increased worldwide societies confronting the trend must deal with questions of free speech and censorship on widely used tech platforms.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
A theory of online hate based on social approval suggests that individuals and groups generate hate messages to gain reward for their antagonism towards mutually hated individuals or groups by providing French and social support to other antagonists. It simultaneously deepens their prejudices.
According to the government accountability office, a hate crime occurs nearly every hour in the United States. It's a growing problem that's been fueled by hate filled internet posts on social media and other internet platforms.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Of course, you can see more about that research in the show notes, how intense do these comments get and how do you deal with them?
Jordan Myrick
So the comments are the worst thing I've ever seen in my like comments are it's so bizarre to me because I have never once in my life thought about commenting something on anything. Once in a blue moon. If I like follow a creator or like a creator, I'll comment, I'll be like you go girl or I don't know if I'm just like supporting I'll be like, yeah, I have never ever, ever thought to be like, I hate that sweater she's wearing, I'm leaving a comment ever in my life.
So that is always interesting to me that people feel the need to do that. I think a lot of people don't feel like they have power in their own life so they get upset and want to have power over people on the internet. I also think people don't realize that your comments don't hurt me. Calling me fat, calling me ugly, calling me annoying, calling me unfunny literally doesn't matter.
Like I think I'm great. I get paid money to be funny. So obviously other people think I'm funny and like I have like a hot incredible girlfriend. So like I'm not mad and you probably don't have any of those things. So I think I feel that way about it. What feels bad is that it can feel very, very scary that there are so many people in the world that feel so angry, so hateful that they want to go online and be rude to someone who is not doing anything wrong whatsoever.
That can be very scary to me. That can make me feel like, ok, I never want to leave my house ever again. Also, I think people can put a lot on you, which I think is always hard because I want to, I want to be there for people and if people see something in me that they like and they resonate with. I think that is awesome. But I also think for people on the internet, people are very quick to put their own baggage on you.
Like I get messages a lot from people that are like, I just wanna say how brave it is that you eat on camera at your job because I am obese just like you and it would embarrass me so much and make me feel so much shame if I if anyone ever saw me eating. So I just wanna say that like, I appreciate that. And I'm like the where the thought is coming from is nice, right?
Like they're saying like, oh, it's cool. You, you do this thing but it's tied in with this thing of putting a lot of your baggage onto me. And I also think it can give you a very warped perception of yourself. because I think it doesn't matter how much you weigh or what you look like. But I think that like it, it makes other people feel weird like I'm not even plus size like in terms of sizing.
I am a size 14 that's still considered straight size. That's not even plus size, which once again does not matter. But I think when people on the internet are quick to be like, oh, you are obese and then other people look at me and they're like, oh, I guess that's what obese is like, that's something that I dealt with a lot in my life of just being, you know, kind of like the, those Jessica Simpson pictures we all saw in the early two thousands when people were like, oh my gosh, like we should kill Jessica Simpson because of what she looks like. Now and then now you look at those pictures and you're like, she looks like the hottest woman I've ever seen in my life. Like she's tight and juicy. Like, what were we all talking about? So I think things like that where it's not, it doesn't matter if I'm fat or not or you perceive me as fat or not or I'm plus size or not plus size, like none of that matters.
But I do think we should be thoughtful when we speak about other people's bodies. And also people will be like, I could never have your confidence. I am very confident and I do feel good in my body. But there are also things where like I have an autoimmune disease. I have been struggling with a chronic health issue with my feet for the last six months that I'm getting surgery on at the end of this month and that has limited me from mobility in the way that I my whole life have been very physically active. That's been a big change for me. Things like that where once again, none of it matters. It's all irrelevant. But like your body changes over time, your body even changes day to day. Sometimes I'll shoot something in the morning and then shoot something at night. And I hate the way I look in the morning shoot and I love the way I look in the afternoon shoot like you just never know, but you also never know how other people feel about their body, what's going on with them, whatever. So I think people need to be like a little more thoughtful about that. And then I would say the most annoying thing is when someone leaves a comment on something being like, I hate gay people, I'm gonna shoot up a pride parade and then I'm like, ok, well, now I have to go look up your school and send them an email that you're threatening to be an active shooter. I'm like, this is so much of my time now that has to be spent on you contacting your Southern Louisiana boys soccer league, telling them what you're doing on. You know what I mean? Like, it's like so much additional work for me where I'm like, you're not actually gonna do this, but also I'm like, not allowed to just not do anything about it. I have to, you know what I mean? Because like, what if they do do it, then it's my fault. I have to be like, all right. So that is also annoying the work of having to like, monitor other people's hate and unwellness.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Today, young adults in America are reporting higher stress levels than older generations. Inflation, spot health care access and the aftermath of COVID. As compounding factors from issues like discrimination and human rights to personal safety and violence.
It's all stressful to younger Americans health and finance related concerns. Top the list of stressors. The phrases millennial dread and gen Z dread are terms coined to encompass the fear and frustrations that young adults today are experiencing.
You have a little bit of a different perspective than what I really hear a lot from content creators which but all the perspectives are valid, but usually what I've heard the most and the message that I've heard amplified the most is how these comments can be personally, really hurtful to someone reading like really mean comments about yourself just might, you know, really shatter your self confidence in your self image, which like I said is obviously super valid.
But the other things that you brought up of just the overall level of just fear and unease that can come from seeing just such a volume of hateful comments producing fear or even the example that you gave about someone saying, you know, potentially being a school shooter or something like that. I think that's such a good point because even not receiving comments like that, I feel such an overwhelming amount of fear of like the state of the world just like being alive.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Jordan's partner, Kendall also creates content having a partner that also does content creation.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Do you think that makes it easier to support each other? Or that it potentially makes it challenging? Because my husband shout out to Richard because now he does want to be a content creator. He's like, this would be fun. I would love this.
Jordan Myrick
And Richard is a fashion king. He's so cute. I would follow Richard in a heartbeat.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
He's so cutie and he is training for the New York City Marathon, which is in almost an exact year. He's qualified. He did like nine races and he qualified for the marathon. So shout out to you honey. And so he wants to do content all around running and his journey toward the marathon. So I'm like helping him figure out that journey, but he overall is like posts once a year when we like go on vacation and like that's it, then never post again.
And, and it's not enough and he has no like doesn't do anything related to content creation as of right now. So if I'm dealing with some kind of issue, like I've had issues less with individual people and more with brands because they will, they hire me. They say we want to talk about black liberation, we want to talk about equality.
We want to talk about diversity and inclusion. I say, OK, girl, let's talk about it. They didn't want to talk about it like that. They didn't want to talk about it this way. They didn't want me to really get into it. They just wanted what's up, this brand is inclusive, use my discount code. That's what they wanted.
Jordan Myrick
They wanted you to be like, hey, I'm black and that's it.
Jordan Myrick, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
And you're like me and my friends, we make jokes all the time.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
They're like Taylor, the face of black liberation across the world because Eddie brand is like, oh Taylor, we put you on it. We're inclusive, we're diverse. We care about all people. So there's that but they just don't like the way that I do it. And they wanted me to do it less quote unquote angry. They wanted me to do it less accurate. They wanted me to use not that much history, let's use less history. So that's kind of what I deal with sometimes.
And when I'm super upset about, you know, an email that I got or something Richard on the one hand is very empathetic and can give me a perspective that's very much not in the world of social media, but similarly, he will because he's not a content creator, he might just like not understand like what I'm, you know what I'm trying to express. So how does that work in your dynamics with your partner?
Jordan Myrick
I'm very lucky because it helps a lot Kendall and I are very on the same page. I think the thing that some people who are on the internet can fall victim to is your relationship becomes the content. And I think that can be toxic for a lot of people. But I think something that people don't always realize is like Kendall and I are professional comedians who were professional comedians before we started making content, we both started making content during the pandemic out of necessity because we had lost our jobs. So, and, and also those were jobs that we were, you know, up until very recently, Kendall and I both were living month to month, I was living month to month. Kendall was in extreme debt. And so we are two adults who are used to working, who are used to having jobs who were already in the entertainment industry, who are pretty good at drawing lines between what is work and what is not.
And so I think that really helps. I think that smooth things out. So we don't run into being like, what's our relationship and what is content which I know is a big problem a lot of creators have and then it's just really helpful. It's really nice. I mean, the only problem is jealousy because Kendall is literally the funniest person in the world and is so famous and everywhere we go, Kendall gets stopped and people want to take pictures with her and like, so yeah, I'm like jealous and that's the worst part of it. because she's just so good recently, I had someone message me a question and I happened to see it and I responded to it and then they were like, oh my God, I can't believe you responded. I'm gonna tell all my friends that a celebrity's girlfriend talked to me on Instagram today and I guess that's it. But even with that, it's like I'm jealous in the most fun way.
Like I'm so happy for Kendall. I reap all the benefits of it. Nobody deserves it more than Kendall. So yeah, I'm like, if I had my finger on it, I think it would just be like unbelievable jealousy because she's just so cute and funny and smart and good and everyone sees that and I love that and that she gets no hate comments. K gets like no hate comments.
Her demographic is like that for her. I know her demographic is women and queer people that are like 30 to like 60 that's, that's a good, that's a good, it's a good group. Unbelievable. All the comments are like beautiful haircut today, such a funny video or whatever. I'm like, oh what a dream.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
When I asked Jordan to be on the podcast, they gave me a few topics that we might want to touch on. One I was interested in and thought you all would be interested in is what Jordan phrased as being queer on the internet.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
They share more about that in this conversation and what that looks like for them in terms of being queer on the internet in general, you mentioned getting comments that are talking about your gender identity, your relationship with your partner.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Do you think that that is amplified more having an online presence? Do you feel like it's something that you deal with in real life in like in human life? Because I guess the internet is real life, right?
Jordan Myrick, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Because it does affect, it's not, it's what you're about to say is right.
Jordan Myrick
I'm sorry to interrupt. But what you're saying is right is like, it does affect your life and like the internet has real life consequences. But it is like the internet is dystopian.
Jordan Myrick, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
It's like being on a different planet 100%.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
And that was such a good way to put it because I was, yes, you got exactly what I was saying that it does have real life consequences, but it also is not real life. So does your life is a queer person in the real real world compounded by the consequences of how that is perceived and discussed on the internet? Like, what is the relationship there? Do you feel like it's more discussed on the internet than it is in your real life?
Jordan Myrick
Yes. I don't think I would think ever about the fact that I'm gay if I wasn't on the internet. because my life feels so normal to me. Like it's not like every day I look at Kendall and I'm like, wow, another Femme presenting person or? Right. You know what I mean? Like, it's just like I would never think about that and it's very normal to me. Granted, I live in Los Angeles.
I grew up, I'm originally from New Orleans. I grew up in the, at the time it was considered the gayest county in America, in South Florida, in Broward County. I went to NYU. I live in Los Angeles. Like I am very lucky that being said, I do not have relationships with a lot of people that could potentially be in my life because I think they're bad and it would negatively affect me.
You know, like I said, I have very supportive parents. Kendall has very supportive parents. We're both extremely lucky in that way. I'm also white, I'm Femme presenting. I think all these things are so important to remember in me talking about why I generally feel fine. I also think something that's nice. And once again, like take all that into context with everything I'm saying, moving forward because I'm speaking from that place of knowing.
I have those things. I am surprised in general by how little people care in real life for the most part growing up, you know, I am originally from the South. Obviously I have met no, I'm related to dealt with a lot of people who are bad homophobic, racist, whatever. And I think that also a lot of that can come from fear, shame, a lack of education, whatever. So I think a lot of times when people are confronted with that in general, they can be fine, you know, once again, not everyone, but I think, you know, one of my first jobs after college was touring doing comedy and we went to a lot of places where I was like, I'm a little nervous about going here. you know, Paducah Kentucky, I got there. Everyone was the nicest they've ever been, you know, it was like, so I think dependent, sorry, I'm trying to be so careful with my words because I don't want to make a blanket statement.
Jordan Myrick, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
But I think in real life, there are less people that actively care about the fact that I am gay, that I am queer, how I present my gender identity, whatever I think on the internet, it's almost exclusively what is talked about the internet has real world ramifications while also somehow not feeling like the real world all the time while also becoming more real every day.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
I think a lot of us feel like we struggle with how complicated and complex this all is.
And again, obviously not making a blanket statement like the, you know what you said, the disclaimer that you gave. But what I really have realized is that on the internet, I might see a demographic that I'm like, I have polar opposite views than this demographic or people that live in this area, right? This might be something that I think internally. But when I engage with actual human beings in real life, I, I've yet to find not, I've yet to find that's not true, but I find a lot less in real life having such violently polar opposite conversations that are like, such just like hateful discourse that I'm like, I fully disagree with who you are as a person and you disagree and fully hate me as a person. Most of the time I will see someone with like a bumper sticker that I feel like is so wild and like insane. But then they'll come out of their car and be like, so nice to me. And I'm really taken aback because the internet has made me believe that's not possible.
Having tough conversations most notably around race and racism is kind of my jam. I wrote a book about it. I love talking about tough topics and getting through all of the stickiness, discomfort, awkwardness and mostly fear that people have wrapped up in saying the wrong thing. Jordan shared a lot with me about how she has engaged with tough topics, especially over the last few years.
Jordan Myrick
I was going to say the internet has far less consequences than real life, I guess. No, because if you, you it can have greater consequences. But what I'm thinking of is like if you walked up to me and you called me a slur, I would punch you in the face, right? Like, I'm fine to fight. and you would not do that.
Jordan Myrick, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
You would not, I'm fine to fight.
Jordan Myrick
I'm fine to fight. I have no problem with confrontation if you would not walk up and call me a slur. for the most part, right? Like most people would not do that. But online, if you call me a slur, online, really nothing happens. So, I think while the internet yes, does have consequences. I think in some ways it has much less consequences than real life.
So I think that warps things and I always go back and forth and I can never decide where I stand on this because sometimes I'm like, oh, I guess it's good that these people on the internet that are so bad or just being like out loud and proud bad because then I know to stay away from them versus I think there are people that are very nefarious who are like, I'm sweet and nice.
But then yeah, go get into a bumper sticker that or go get into a car that like the bumper stickers are not so on. And sometimes I, I'm like, oh, that's rough because that can feel kind of scary to me of me thinking I'm having like a nice normal interaction with this person and you can kind of let your guard down and then all of a sudden you're like, oh no, you are very bad. And I think that can be scary. But also I don't want to be having like level 10 hateful interactions with every single
person. I, I meet, I think, I think I agree with you. I think what would really help if more people interacted because this is what I was saying. I think so many people operate from a place of fear or like, I think so much of hate is fear. I think it's fear of looking stupid. I think it's fear of having something taken away from you.
Jordan Myrick, Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
I think it's fear of not understanding through my work facilitating tough conversations.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
And most importantly, those that are in safe spaces with willing participants. I found the greatest barriers are the fear sounding stupid or because cancel culture is such a big part of our culture being eternally marred with the shame of saying something wrong. The idea of hurting someone's feelings is another challenge. And again, these are facilitated conversations.
I'm not talking about just person to person dynamics. But the idea of hurting the feelings of someone that you do or don't know or just generally looking bad to the group is another challenge. The courage to admit confusion or say I need clarification is another hurdle. People don't like it to seem like they don't understand what's going on. People also notoriously don't do the deep work of learning.
They google something quickly consume a short response and feel satisfied, but that is not the true work of learning, understanding and battling internal bias. A lot of us have very short attention spans because we are constantly scrolling. We love those quick hits of interesting facts, but we are not doing the deep work, the true work of truly learning, understanding and becoming different.
Jordan Myrick
I also think that there's a formative aspect to the internet where if someone says something wrong and someone corrects them that is public. I'm not saying people should or shouldn't do that. But I think it can bring out embarrassment in people. And I think people don't always, you know, not everyone, no matter what your background is, you have to remember that not everyone is coming from the same place that you are.
I am very lucky. I have progressive parents who are thoughtful who are kind, who have a variety of different types of friends. I grew up in major cities, not everyone is coming from that place. And I think it can be helpful to have privacy, to learn that you're wrong, have one on one conversations to learn that you're wrong, to learn that you've made mistakes.
And I think now so much of so much correcting is done on the internet. And once again, that needs to be done. I'm not saying that that shouldn't be done. I'm not saying that we need to be precious with people who are racist or homophobic or transphobic or whatever. But I think sometimes in terms of finding people to be more receptive.
I think there can be elements where everything is kind of put on such a big platform. So public people's reaction is going to be defensive rather than being like, huh, let take a second to like, think about this privately because people just don't feel like they have that time. Does that make sense?
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
Yeah, it does. Absolutely.
So much of what you said, I was nodding furiously while the conversations that I facilitated have been either with companies or organizations or they've been with individuals who have signed up for one of our programs or courses through activism or they've been at companies that I've worked at where I have de I work, the internet is a very completely different experience. These are strangers, most individuals are hiding behind a keyboard and that definitely provides some unique challenges.
Jordan Myrick
We are all people, all you can do is try to educate yourself and grow and not make that mistake again and be open and generous when people correct you. It's very hard speaking from experience, it's very hard, especially when you don't have ill intention. I think that makes it so much harder when you say something and somebody's like, oh, it's kind of fucked up and you're like, oh my God.
Well, I didn't mean it to be fucked up. Well, I'm, I was trying to be f and I didn't and I didn't know that and da da whatever. And it's like, yes, all that is true and you know that within your heart. So just keep that within your heart, say, oh, thank you for correcting me or whatever. And then like move on and think about it more and like go to the library.
I, I know that sounds corny, but I really think that gosh, I'm getting on a soapbox. I'm also like, people have no time now, so a lot of people don't have time to read a book. And I think that is gonna be society's downfall. Is that so many people like, you know, would not have to answer questions on a one on one level if people had time to research things and whatever.
But most of us are not given the luxury of that, that time. Yes. which I love my job and thank you for letting me have it. But it's ii I have learned so much from books and when I find out I make a misstep, when I find out that I didn't know as much about something, I think it's very easy to be like, oh my God, I'm so stupid. Why didn't I know that? Why didn't I whatever.
It's like, well, it's irrelevant. And also you can't know everything about everything. Just one person in the last few years. I have tried to make a greater effort to turn to literature written by people that were affected by the thing, to turn to historical literature, to learn more. And it's not only opened my eyes, but it's also made it so much easier understand things to make less mistakes because you understand the context of things so helpful.
So that, yeah, I think that's something like I would encourage everybody but especially other like white people, especially white queers, it's a lot easier to not be so defensive about things.
Taylor Rae Almonte-Roman
I was honestly so hyped after my conversation with Jordan. I am so sad because Jordan lives truly on the other side of the country from me. I'm in New York and Jordan is in California. So that does make me sad because every time we have a combo, every time we've gotten together, I feel like Jordan just knows what's up. I was laughing, I was nodding.
I was in agreement. I was aligned and it's just so great to have those kinds of conversations. Again. I am so grateful for Jordan's openness, vulnerability and just candid responses as I was talking about, you know, in my little voice over while I was editing about how having tough conversations can be so challenging because people really exposing themselves and being vulnerable can be hard.
That's kind of the same experience that every guest has on a podcast. Like even that's the experience I have plenty of times on my own podcast. You say something and then you think, oh, did I sound OK? Did I sound dumb? Was I, you know, using the right language or the right term. Did I say what I meant? Did it come out clearly? And I just really love that Jordan was letting out, you know, so many thoughts and sharing so many opinions that I feel really take a lot of bravery to talk about.
Not because they're necessarily controversial in any way, but just because talking about these things can make a lot of folks feel uncomfortable and weary. So shout out to Jordan because that is the work that we want to be doing. I cannot believe we're coming to the end of this season. We only have two more episodes left with guests coming up. I have Kira West who is my co founder of activism and then I have Tara Nicholas and that is it for season one.
Can you believe it? Girl? I truly cannot. This has been the time of my life but don't worry, we'll be back. We got more seasons coming up. You can follow Jordan Myrick at Jordan Myrick with a one instead of an I as always a full transcription of the episode along with citations can be found on my website. All of those links are available in the show notes. See you out there.
References
Bull, Marian. 2021. “When a Hobby Becomes a Job.” Vox. August 16, 2021. https://www.vox.com/the-highlight/22620178/hobby-job-leisure-labor.
Hoffner, Cynthia A., and Bradley J. Bond. 2022. “Parasocial Relationships, Social Media, & Well-Being.” Current Opinion in Psychology 45 (1): 101306. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.copsyc.2022.101306.
Medaris, Anna. 2023. “Gen Z Adults and Younger Millennials Are ‘Completely Overwhelmed’ by Stress.” Apa.org. November 1, 2023. https://www.apa.org/topics/stress/generation-z-millennials-young-adults-worries.
O’Sullivan, Sadhbh. 2021. “It’s Complicated: The Problem with the One-Sided Relationships We’re All Having Online.” Www.refinery29.com. October 4, 2021. https://www.refinery29.com/en-gb/parasocial-relationships-online-cancelling-bon-appetit.
Office, U. S. Government Accountability. 2024. “Online Extremism Is a Growing Problem, but What’s Being Done about It? | U.S. GAO.” Www.gao.gov. February 13, 2024. https://www.gao.gov/blog/online-extremism-growing-problem-whats-being-done-about-it.
Walther, Joseph B. 2022. “Social Media and Online Hate.” Current Opinion in Psychology 45 (January). https://doi.org/10.1016/j.copsyc.2021.12.010.
